409-371 History

[MYTA21]

Hello,
Just awaiting delivery to Ardrossan South Australia from Melbourne of 409 no. 371 purchased from Dale Allan on March 12th
Car was shipped to SA from QLD about 6 years ago, having been sent from
UK about 15 years ago. Car has "Guy Salmon" logo on kick plates.
Currently finished in dark bottle green, burgundy leather, black carpets.
Any prior history of the car much appreciated.
Car joins TA21 DHC and TD21 Alvis' in the garage - hope they don't argue!

[Geoff Dowdle]

Hello, MYTA21 ???????

The history of your 409 is limited
(Compliments of BOCA)

Chassis 409 7321 , car# 321 , Engine# 1641.91331C
Original owner Patrick Boulter , Guilford, Surrey May 1966
then Guy Salmon Automobiles , Thames Ditton, Surrey
Imported by Dr. Daniel O'Conner of Mt Tamborine , Qld in c1990 Regn #
676AWM
Next Dale Allen , Emerald , Vic 19/3/01

Regards
Geoff Dowdle
darin@wix.com.au

[pasini s]

Hello everybody,

this is my first message on this Forum and I would like to send my best greetings to all the Bristol enthusiasts everywhere.

I have read Geoff's message about the history of '409-371' and I am wondering if it would be possible to learn something more abot the early history of my own 409, ch.#7355, engine B318 06 27A, delivered to Anthony Crook in date 4 January 1967. It is in a remarkably original condition (it still has the original engine, gearbox, keys etc) and the only non-original part is the colour, that the previous owner changed from the original 'M.607' silver (actually I don't know if it was a dark or light silver...) to a Rolls-Royce Regal Red. I have been told that it allegedly was the first 409fitted with power steering but other details would be very interesting.

Thank you very much for your help and support,

Stefano Pasini

[Markus Berzborn]

I assume you are the Stefano Pasini who wrote a book about EMT and is well known in the audiophile community?
Very interesting to notice that your good taste obviously also extends to the world of cars.

Kind regards,
Markus

[Ashley James]

I thought EMT was one of the companies that lost out to Panasonic
(in service with no less than 5000 broadcasters worldwide) in the
Broadcast market. I didn't know audiophiles bough them as well Markus.

I'm afraid that my Thorens went in the bin the day I could buy a CD
player and now I use an Apple TV for all my music, photos and movies
as well as Youtube where I periodically play either Stefan's 400
climbing Prescott or the BRM V16. Both are excellent through proper
modern hi fi with 325 wpc. Real life SPLs too!

PS. The six cylinder Honda 250 cc bike makes a good noise too!

[Markus Berzborn]

Mainly in Asia there is a kind of cult following for EMT turntables. They sometimes pay almost insane prices.
I like them as well, but I'm not a fan, it is not really my cup of tea so to speak. I prefer other record players.
Although for sound recording, I'm very much into (more or less) vintage equipment such as Telefunken M5, M10, M20, Studer A80 and so on.
Sure I also have a CD player and a computer (to write this posting, for example), but do not really need them for music.
The CD player is only used when I cannot get a specific recording on LP.

Kind regards,
Markus

[pasini s]

Hello Markus,

thank you for your flattering words. Yes, I wrote a book about EMTs and own a small collection of those machines, which I use to listen to my collection of 6.000+ vinyl records. Of course I try to use them all in turns; now I'm listening to a 1978 BBC-version 950. Prices of classic EMTs are high nowadays: I could sell this BBC 950 today for almost the same money that I spent to purchase my 409. Please remember that they are high-quality machines with excellent sonic qualities (IMHO of course) and a comparable new TT may be much more expensive.

EMT Site Map

I also like to collect Studers (6 of them now, 2 A80s being now parked in my garage beside the 409), Telefunkens (both broadcast turntables and tape decks) and of course Nagras.

Dear Ashley, I don't think that EMT ever 'lost' to Panasonic, they were simply in a different price league. (Please remember that in 1976 a new 'standard', no-frills EMT 950 would cost in Germany almost as much as a VW Golf.) Whenever the budget allowed it, radio/TV corporations always bought EMTs because they have always been extremely good, sturdy, easy to use, nearly impossible to abuse and they needed little adjustment, so they worked flawlessly in the surgically clean audio rooms of the Italian RAI or in the studios of the Addis Abeba radio station. For the same reasons RAI, ORF, ZDF etc always preferred Nagras, Studers, Neumann to cheaper Japanese alternatives (RAI bought hundreds of EMTs and still use them), until digital music and CDs changed it all.

Nowadays the 409 is absorbing all my spare time so I do not listen much to records. Maybe I'll have some more time in my hands during winter when #7355 will be stripped in the body shop for a complete respray.

It's good to know that there are some serious audiophiles amongst Bristol collectors....

Ciao to you all,

Stefano

[Ashley James]

We're actually manufacturers! And very controversial amongst audiophiles because we've done a better job for a fraction of the price.

I understand and respect a love of and enthusiasm for old equipment and have a 400 to prove it, but I have to admit that I can't and never could understand why anyone might believe it's better than decent modern. If Music is the hobby, then why make it less accessible and more distorted. Audiophiles are a law unto themselves and most music is made on Apple Computers using Apple software and recordings have never sounded closer to the real thing in my view.

Old cars represent the art, the passion and the eccentricities of their creators as well as the skill of the craftsmen who built them and that I love. I see it in the old audio equipment you collect Stefano, but IMO it isn't in most audiophile gear because the companies aren't big enough to afford real talent, only egos.


Ashley

[Markus Berzborn]

Originally Posted by Ashley James

We're actually manufacturers! And very controversial amongst audiophiles because we've done a better job for a fraction of the price.

I respect all manufacturers, but think they should leave it to their current and prospective customers to decide who did the better job and why.

Kind regards,
Markus

[pasini s]

but IMO it isn't in most audiophile gear because the companies aren't big enough to afford real talent, only egos.

Dear Ashley, I fully agree with you! But now I think that we are going a little bit OT for a Bristol Cars Forum....

Thanks anyway

Stefano

[Ashley James]

Markus

We can show a reduction in distortion by a factor of one thousand over the sort of system that you might have and far more if you're using a turntable.

All the parts we use are sold on performance proven with measurement because that is how everything is judged and improvements shown by every manufacturer designing anything electronic. Only audiophiles think differently and we usually refer them to experiments done at Cambridge University that show how easily our ears are fooled. You need proof.

I'm not going to explain the benefits of my system on here, only point out that audiophiles are a small, rather marginalised group with beliefs and prejudices that haven't been taken seriously by professionals (where we sell some of our stuff) or the public at large for years. I'll happily give a list of forums where these people exchange views if anyone thinks I'm exaggerating and would like to judge for themselves, but as an engineering company we don't do things unless we can prove they work.
The hi fi industry is nearing it's end and it's not at all surprising in my view.

So that this post qualifies as "on Topic" and in addition to apologising for standing up for science as above, I'll own up to deserting work this afternoon to replace a rear wheel bearing and oil seal in my 400. The old one was Russian, so I'm not sure where that came from. I must say that I don't know how people enjoy old cars without totally rebuilding them. Anything I didn't do, I've subsequently had to do.

Ash

[TLF799R]

Blimey, I thought I was argumentative but I've never scrapped over what I
assume, under the mass of jargon, is ONLY a record player!!!

Philippa

[Ashley James]

Philippa

If you try an audiophile forum, you'll see that it's worse than a third world war might be! Scientist like us get loads of stick from characters who can hear the difference between mains cables and all sorts of other things. Hopefully Markus and I can declare a truce and leave an arena for less controversial matters Bristol.

It's probably twenty years since I played a record, everything is from computers by wireless now and controlled by iPods or iPhones.

Ash

[pasini s]

Dear Ashley

(you can answer me privately if you wish) what components are you manufacturing? I am always interested in new audio stuff designed by real enthusiasts, and you seem one (as Markus surely is, of course.)

A little audio-based point of interest for Bristol enthusiasts:

Bristol 409: the dashboard

Under the dashboard of my 409 you might see the small, delightful Tannoy-branded fader control for the 3 main speakers. As my custom-built Hug corner speakers use huge Tannoy Gold Monitor speakers, I feel like this switch helps me feel some of the ambience of my home hi-fi systems (with its Quad IIs, McIntosh 275, McIntosh 2205, Telefunken ELAs etc) in my classic Bristol. I love this switch.

Thank you again and sorry for boring non-hi-fi-listeners with this discussion, but Britain is one of the cradles of real hi-fi reproduction and tube Quads, full-range Tannoys and idler-wheel Garrards have always been favourites of classic audiophiles with the same type of raffish appeal that Bristol have on classic car enthusiasts.

Cheers

Stefano

(P.S.: sorry for the very poor English,.... I hope that you will catch my drift anyway.)

[Ashley James]

Stefano

Details sent privately to avoid the wrath of Kevin!

I have Radiomobile Model 100s in my Bentley and my 400 and have restored both, but the programs are dire, so I haven't bothered with an FM conversion.

I recommend Radio Dismuke for fun and Spotify for music lovers who don't mind parting with a tenner a month. Some people chuck their CDs etc and just use it for all their listening. It works on an iPhone too.

I have Apple TV so that when I'm listening to music a mosaic of Bristol and Bentley pictures scroll across the screen to keep my interest. Here are some of them Flickr: Bristols and Bentleys' Photostream

Ash